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[compu_85]

I was just looking on yahoo auctions Japan... looks like the Lisa was sold there too!

I wonder how many were sold there...

[compu_85]

Added a few more systems from CHM and their catalog numbers, and some from a Redditor (one of which was made the same day as my "XL" system!)

As I add these, the estimate of the number of systems goes down...

-J

[blusnowkitty]

So that answers one question - Macintosh XLs sold by Apple really were just 2/10s with a MacWorks boot disk instead of the Office System.

The only other question that remains is, if sales and manufacturing persisted into mid-1985, where are the systems from 1985? Unless those were the 2,700 that got dumped in Utah... but the article implies/says those were broken/RMA/returned machines, no?

[compu_85]

As I understood it, the machines that got dumped had to be complete, working systems.

The date on "The last Lisa Lid" is 5/30/85. Stands to reason there should be some Lisas from 85....

One other note:
I found this picture on Adam's site: http://adam.trideja.com/Apple%20Computer%20Pics/Lisa/Lisa.jpg
Note the AppleNet number is the same as the one in the X/Profile video rom kit!

-J

[compu_85]

Here's another question: does anyone else have a power supply with a suspiciously serial number looking sticker on it?

I've got a early Apple supply, with sn 2719. My XL machine came with a Datapower 113056, and 2/10 has 80754.

I've spend some more time working on the sheet. By sorting all the systems by build date, then serial number, I was able to figure out the AppleNet numbers of some which were missing. There were also a few errors in serial numbers.

-J

[compu_85]

Some more observations:

If we assume that serial numbers start at 1 for a given day and count up, and then add together the highest serial numbers recorded for each day so far, the total is 25,404. I treated serial numbers starting with B and A as if they were different factories, so some says got 2 counts. If we include the 810 count from the 20th day of 1982 the count jumps 26,214... I would say it's an outlier, but we have 5 systems from that day! So I don't know if the other estimate is as trustworthy as we were thinking, since simply counting the serial numbers we've collected is more than double.

Also, it looks like Apple was building 2/10s at the same time as Lisa 1s? I have to wonder if there's some bottom plate swapping corrupting the numbers.

This work is making the 50k number seem more likely.

-J

[fri0701]

I've been trying to lay down some "invariants" I see across the recorded serial numbers, and I wanted to hear your thoughts:

1. AppleNet numbers are unique, likely sequential with no gaps, and one was assigned to each machine. I know that we have a conflict with #00104218, but that's the only one we've seen, so I'm tempted to count it as a one-off mistake for now. Since this number is used for copy protection (and perhaps was planned as a global ID number for AppleNet), surely this was meant to be unique.

2. Taking an AppleNet number and subtracting the last digits of the S/N (which I'll refer to as the "batch count" here) gives you a "batch start" number. Each day has one and only one of these "batch start" numbers.

There are some cases where a "batch start" number is shared across multiple days. It is also clear that, although there was a general upward trend, these "batch start" numbers (and therefore, the AppleNet numbers in general) did not monotonically increase as time went on.

My working theory is that on any given day, the factory chose a batch of AppleNet numbers to produce, denoted by a "batch start" number. They didn't necessarily start at the beginning of that range, but picked an open section within it and produced what they could that day. The fact that the same "batch start" number is shared between some days greatly reduces the estimate of the number of Lisas produced from just counting up the "batch count" numbers per day.

As for the total number of Lisas, if we do hold rule #1 above, the number of Lisas produced would be around 12,000 via the tank problem.

Hopefully we can keep refining these theories and numbers as we log more machines! I'd love to hear anyone's thoughts on this.


 

[blusnowkitty]

I treated serial numbers starting with B and A as if they were different factories, so some says got 2 counts.

I can't prove it, but I'm almost positive that B08Bs were made in California, while As were made in Carrolton, TX. I've heard as much said before that manufacturing started off near HQ and later moved to the Apple II plant in Texas, and this seems to track with the trends we see in the SN tracker. B08Bs account for 1982 and early 1983, by mid-1983 we see a mix of B08Bs and As, and then by late 1983 it's all As.

I'm also inclined to believe fri's post about Applenets being batched instead of sequential.

[fri0701]

"1983: Apple opens a highly automated plant in Fremont, Calif., to manufacture the first Macintosh computers. It also said it would shut down a pilot factory in Cupertino, Calif., which made the Lisa computer, and move that production to Carrollton and Cork." https://www.wsj.com/articles/BL-DGB-25630

"October and November saw a series of announcements and releases for the Lisa. On October 4, Apple started shipping versions of the Lisa to Australia, New Zealand, France, Germany and Britain. These shipments came from the new international Lisa plant in Cork, Ireland." https://mirrors.apple2.org.za/www.bitsavers.org/pdf/apple/lisa/development_history/articles/Dines_-_The_Lisa_A_Case_History_1985.pdf

So it looks like we're dealing with 3 plants: Cupertino, CA; Carrolton, TX; Cork, Ireland.

The "Made in USA / Ireland" sticker on the Lisa's case is a good clue. The earliest Lisa I've seen that's labeled "Ireland" is from June 14, 1983. It looks like both A-style and B-style serial numbers were produced there.

The earliest A-style serial number I've seen is March 3rd, 1983. The latest B-style is September 20th, 1983.

Interestingly, in reference to my last post, we also have evidence of Lisas marked "USA" and "Ireland" made on the same day sharing the same "batch start" number.

I can't prove it, but I'm almost positive that B08Bs were made in California, while As were made in Carrolton, TX.

This is an interesting theory... since both styles were made in the Ireland plant, however, I'm more inclined to keep with the idea that the change was to do with the switch from the original Lisa to the Lisa 2 series.

[sigma7]

Here's another question: does anyone else have a power supply with a suspiciously serial number looking sticker on it?

Of the 4 power supplies in sight, 2 have those white labels:

a 1.2A is labelled *71090* with the barcode underneath
a 1.8A is labelled *301488* without the barcode

Both of those came to me from Dafax (and also have the round green sticker with the OK stamp). Another 1.8A has the Dafax green sticker but no white sticker.

The 1.8A have the DataPower aluminum foil label with the embossed serial number, so I wonder if Sun Remarketing added the white stickers for inventory management.

[compu_85]

I kind of doubt all 3 of my systems came from Sun, but I suppose it's possible?

I just added RR lot #8013, Del Yocam's System. It's noted on the front  "First Production Build May 1983" and has the manf date 3053. That's a nice tidbit of data.

-J

[blusnowkitty]

Such a shame that system. Beautifully preserved on the outside, but destroyed on the inside thanks to those pesky batteries. Out of my price range too... some day I'll find a set of Twiggies and a faceplate to deconvert my 2/5 back to what it should be.

Looking at that auction, at the very end, they quote a 10,000 units manufactured figure. Who here's an appraiser for RR Auction?

I'll have to look at my supplies again when I can. I don't believe either of mine have those barcodes on them.

[paule]

Shocking that they glossed over the battery corrosion!

[sigma7]

I kind of doubt all 3 of my systems came from Sun, but I suppose it's possible?

I'd guess it is more likely that only the power supplies were replaced with units from Sun Remarketing, but maybe there is another explanation for the white stickers.

SR was selling SCSI boards with internal drives mounted on them, as well as the Sun20/30/40; I expect quite a few 1.2A supplies were overloaded.

[fri0701]

The plot thickens... it seems we have our second AppleNet clash.
Compare Patrick's photo here:

...with this Facebook marketplace ad:


Both are AppleNet #00102439. Just like with the last AppleNet clash, one is an A-serial number and one is a B-serial number. We may have to start considering the possibility that AppleNets are not globally unique - perhaps only unique by factory or model or some other factor.

As a test, if you separate the AppleNets for A-serials and B-serials, taking into account that the A-series starts at a higher number, the tank problem now estimates just over 15,000 Lisas produced.