Hi Mark,
Nice to hear from a fellow Lisa computer owner. Answers to your questions follow. I've also CCed the Lisa List since I think this topic would interest this group and also possibly provide some type of beneficial action in the areas you are asking about.
The Lisa list (LisaList <lisalist_at_email.domain.hidden>) is a very good place to ask about hardware problems. Several of the people on this list know the Lisa hardware very well.
I am not aware of Apple releasing the sources for either the low-level OS or the applications (i.e. the office system suite) or the low-level "desktop libraries" (e.g. menu manager). In my opinion obtaining sources like this from Apple would be very difficult especially in today's Apple corporate environment in which historical items such as this are of no interest to Apple executives (I suspect the only Apple executive today who had any involvement with the Lisa was JOHN COUCH who headed the Lisa project -- he was general manager of the POS division -- today he's head of Apple's education department).
The only source relating to the Lisa which Apple has released is the Quickdraw graphics library source;
http://www.computerhistory.org/highlights/macpaint/
The problem with Apple releasing Lisa sources is 1) Apple would need to find these (which may be difficult since last I heard these were on hard disks in a archive room) and 2) Apple would need to spend the time finding and reviewing and authorizing the release and 3) much of the Lisa programming formed the foundation for the Macintosh software especially the Macintosh desktop user interface and there may be copyright and trademark issues relating to this.
I corresponded with LARRY TESLER (http://www.nomodes.com/Larry_Tesler_Consulting/Home.html), head of the Lisa Office System, many years ago about Lisa sources and he was not sure Apple could release. Recommend you contact him and see what he has to say today. He may have some pull at Apple since he worked there for I recall around 20 years and became a rather high-level executive. The Quickdraw source release could serve as an incentive or precedence for other Lisa source releases.
You could also try to contact the Lisa programmers themselves. My Lisa paper lists who worked on what. E.g., Tom Malloy was one of the LisaWrite programmers. I suspect these people have the sources.
My recommendation is contact the COMPUTER HISTORY MUSEUM and see if 1) they have any Lisa sources (they may which they have not publiced) and 2) if this museum could be convinced to want these materials and ask Apple for them. I think a request from an individual such as me or yourself to Apple was not go anywhere.
I would very much like to see the Lisa sources and would help as much as possible in seeing if Apple can release them. This would include sources for the operating system (e.g. file system), desktop libraries (e.g. menu manager), development tools (Workshop, compilers, editor, linker), Desktop Manager (Lisa "finder"), Lisa applications (LisaWrite/Draw/Calc/Graph/Project/List/Terminal), and peripheral card firmware (e.g. parallel port card).
The Lisa boot ROM source is available on the internet, I don't believe this was released by Apple. Just noticed the Lisa sony driver is on the internet now, I have not sen this before which is a treat.
http://bitsavers.org/pdf/apple/lisa/firmware/IO_ROM_88_Listing_Dec83.pdf
Note obtaining Apple sources is not impossible, but is not easy either. E.g., I am also an Apple /// owner and have obtained most of the Apple sources for this machine. This includes the ///'s operating system called SOS (Sophisticated Operating System) and its Business BASIC interpreter. To my understanding these sources have never been released by Apple and the /// and Lisa originated at around the same time.
It is also my understanding that early Macintosh sources are also available but knowing where to look is not universally known. All I can say here is the original Finder sources have not been lost and the sources for the Macintosh ROM from around 1990 are floating around. I've heard there is an effort to preserve these materials and that the Computer History Museum may be part of this effort.
The Lisa Pascal compiler did not generate p-code as produced by Apple's earlier Apple II and Apple /// Pascal compilers.
Instead, Lisa Pascal was licensed from Silicon Valley Software (SVS) and internally produced i-code which the Lisa 68000 Code Generator converted to 68000 machine code.
I-code is not the same as p-code, the "i" represents "intermediate" ("p" in p-code represents "pseudo" and not "pascal" as many people claim since this type of code pre-dates Pascal's existance) and as far as I recall from correspondence with one of the Lisa Pascal programmers (Albert Hoffman) i-code was lower level than p-code. If I recall correctly, Hoffman said i-code is basically a flattened dump of the compiler's internal tree-based code data structures. P-code on the other hand can be considered a higher level representation of program constructs which are easier to use for machine level code generation. I also recall Hoffman said Lisa Pascal evolved from the ETH Pascal system and not the UCSD Pascal system. I agree with this since I've seen the Macintosh MPW Pascal compiler source and this source is definitely not UCSD based and seems in certain areas to match the ETH Pascal sources which are on the internet. The MPW Pascal source is not available on the internet to my knowledge.
Details about the Lisa pascal compiler and its i-codes are available from the bitsavers.org web site which has a rather large and rare collection of Lisa internal materials. Bitsavers has the Lisa Pascal ERS and internals information which are interesting reading.
http://bitsavers.org/pdf/apple/lisa/pascal_monitor/Language_Specification_Lisa_Pascal_Feb82.pdf http://bitsavers.org/pdf/apple/lisa/pascal_monitor/Pascal_Development_System_Internal_Documentation_Jan82.pdf
What was also called I recall the "Lisa Print Shop" may have lots of Lisa materials. This was a company which I believe was given a lot of Lisa materials by Apple as part of a business agreement with Apple after Apple discontinued the Lisa. People connected with this may have some materials, but I don't know who they are. I've heard these materials may have ended up at the Computer History Museum or DigiBarn computer collection group.
--- On March 4, 2012, at 11:52 AM, Mark Waterbury wrote:Received on 2015-07-16 06:34:09
> Hi, David:
>
> Recently, I have become interested in the Apple Lisa ... and its software.
>
> I may be able to acquire a Lisa 2/10 in "working" condition, except for the power supply needs work.
>
> In any case, I have been studying what is available on the internet, using google, etc.
>
> I know that you are a collector of many Apple related artifacts and seem to know a lot about what is available, etc.
>
> Do you know if Apple ever released any of the source code for the Lisa Operating System (LOS) or the original "bundled" applications? I believe that much of that stuff was written in a version of Apple Pascal that compiled into P-Code and then translated the P-Code into equivalent 68000 code.
>
> Since the Lisa is a long-since "dead" system, do you think Apple Inc. could be convinced to release the source code for the Lisa?
>
> I would appreciate hearing from you on this topic.
>
> Thanks in advance.
>
> All the best,
>
> Mark S. Waterbury
-- ----- You received this message because you are a member of the LisaList group. The group FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/lisa.html To post to this group, send email to lisalist_at_email.domain.hidden To leave this group, send email to lisalist+unsubscribe_at_email.domain.hidden For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lisalist
This archive was generated by hypermail 2.4.0 : 2020-01-13 12:15:16 EST