Re: "Lisa" mice

Hi David, hello Rick,

I just took a look at the Apple Computer Patent - Lisa Computer Mouse and it's obviously a fact, that this patent is dated 08/1984?! Wow! So it seems that Apple got this patent after the MacIntosh has been sold (remember it was in January 1984) at a time, when the Mac Mouse was sold with the Mac (here in Europe with a bundle: Mac, Mouse and Keyboard and 3,5" System Disks)
The early Lisas (from 1982) weren't shipped with a mouse; you really had to buy your Lisa-Mouse seperately. Perhaps I find some brochures to verify that with some documents of that time. I'll post them or somebody else will do that.
You only could buy the Lisa-Mouse seperately... and at that time it was only one mouse availlable: The Lisa-Mouse with the characteristical small mouse-button.
In the year 1984, in spring, Apple began to sell the MacIntosh; and they sold it only with the Mac-Mouse.
Parallel they keep on selling the Lisa.
I only can provide some data about Apples products here in Europe, maybe in the States they had a different product policy, although I can't imagine that, because: Why should they see a need for that? Here in Europe you could still buy the Lisa in 1984 - but still without a bundled mouse! The Lisa 2 was sold without a mouse, too. At the end of the Lisa-Area Apple sold the Lisa with all components and so you could buy the Lisa 2 and Mac XL later with the included Mouse. I know that SUN Remarketing bundled the Lisa with the Mac-Mouse, but only a few customers bought that (here in Europe). In 1989 (I'm not 100% shure, please correct me if the year is not right) the remaining Apple Lisas were dumped in Utah. This was at a time, when the Mac-Mouse was manufactured in its second configuration. The first Mac-Mouse had a rectangular plug, the second had a more rounded plug shape with smaler screws. But both were different comparing with the Lisa-Mouse, which had a fully plastic plug and no screws at all. These are the main differences beside the mouse-button.

By the way, Steve Jobs presented the Apple Lisa in 1983 at the International Design Conference in Aspen. Some pictures are still availlable and perhaps you could see the Lisa-Mouse in Steve's hand...

greetings TOM from Bavaria, the country of the alps, the marvellous castles of Koenig Ludwig and the original Octoberfest in Munich

Am 24.07.2014 um 22:30 schrieb Shirl Casner:

> Hello Rick,
>
> Lisa mouse development information is available from the Stanford
> University archives. Info attached. Same for Apple's Lisa mouse
> patent (this also patents drop-down menus).
>
> My reading from these materials is the Lisa mouse development pre-
> dated the Mac mouse. See page 26 of the Stanford document for Lisa
> mouse history and page 38 for Mac mouse comments.
>
> It would also be very interesting reading to obtain copies of
> Apple's in-house mouse development newsletter which was called
> MOUSE DROPPINGS. The Stanford document mentions this. Obtaining
> development mice would also be interesting, believe these are
> very ... very rare.
>
> Hope this helps.
>
> - David Craig
>
> ===
>
> On July 24, 2014, at 2:08 PM, Lisa2.com wrote:
>
>> Until any Apple documents can be found or an Apple employee of the
>> time can verify this, all the info on this subject is just
>> speculation or opinion. It's assumed that since the Lisa predates
>> the Mac that Lisa mouse design predates the Mac mouse. Once the
>> Mac began shipping it's really a gray area as to if and when Apple
>> started shipping mac mice with Lisa.
>>
>> I can tell you from observation that most Lisa 1 and Lisa2/5
>> systems I have worked on had the Lisa style mouse and the 2/10
>> systems had Mac type mice. It's also known that late in the Lisa
>> product cycle Apple was reluctant to build more parts inventory
>> for the Lisa product line and the Mac was selling poorly, so it
>> would have been logical for Apple not make more Lisa mice and use
>> Mac mice at that point, but this is just a educated guess.
>>
>> Lisa mice were a popular item for Mac users early on (before 3rd
>> party mice where available) who liked the "feel" of the Lisa mouse
>> over the Mac mouse, and a lot of mouse "trading" was going on.
>> Also later when SUN Remarking was selling the old inventory for
>> Apple they did a lot of mixing and matching of components to get
>> together complete working systems to sell, so I would not be
>> uncommon for them to ship an early Lisa with a Mac mouse.
>>
>> Rick
>

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